So was the welding bill!MRustbucket wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:43 pmHooli wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:40 pmSure is...
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=57
I think my X308 XJR was more rotten than your XJ40.
That link was unexpected!
Jaguar Sovereign: rust and rehabilitation.
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Re: Jaguar Sovereign: rust and rehabilitation.
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Re: Jaguar Sovereign: rust and rehabilitation.
Fantastic stuff, keep it up. Sad as it is I would love to see some pics of the XJ40 / XJR6 hybrid
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Re: Jaguar Sovereign: rust and rehabilitation.
The 'eighties glory of the XJ40 launch video is on Youtube. No doubt this will have been playing on a 14" SONY monitor TV in some cosy corner of the dealer. Welcome to 1986.
I actually went to the launch party of the XJ40 at my local Jag dealer with my father. I was at school at the time and after all the hype was very pleased he took me to this. I remember it was really well attended with lots of champagne - and the new car was noticeably well received on the night. There were 3 XJ40s there - a Daimler, a 2.9 litre XJ6 in bright red and a Sovereign 3.6 in gold.
A few months later my dad was also invited to the local BMW dealer to see the launch of the new 7 Series. This was a thoroughly more sober and efficient affair with grey metal and glass everywhere, all very G-Plan. The new 7 was well received too, but at the time the praise seemed possibly a little more muted than the new Jag. There was only one car there - a really low spec 730i. My dad thought it a bit grim. I discovered later that the E32 could be a lovely car in the right spec, but I always preferred the Jag. The new Jaguar would tarnish itself somewhat in the following year with teething problems, which was rather sad given the car's big heart and many abilities. It's reputation would nevr recover, the car becoming yet another unappreciated but excellent British car. BMW however would never look back. The E32 was a market force in the way the E23 never achieved. I also noticed how much younger and 'go-ahead' as they said at the time the BMW customers were. All big smiles, super-confidence, shiny suits and filofaxes. The Jaguar customers all looked like John Harvey-Jones.
Jaguar XJ40 the legend 1/3
Jaguar XJ40 the legend 2/3
Jaguar XJ40 the legend 3/3
Even though they were a small company with limited resources, Jaguar put a huge effort into the design of the XJ40. Was the XJ40 the last major production car designed by a handful of people?
I actually went to the launch party of the XJ40 at my local Jag dealer with my father. I was at school at the time and after all the hype was very pleased he took me to this. I remember it was really well attended with lots of champagne - and the new car was noticeably well received on the night. There were 3 XJ40s there - a Daimler, a 2.9 litre XJ6 in bright red and a Sovereign 3.6 in gold.
A few months later my dad was also invited to the local BMW dealer to see the launch of the new 7 Series. This was a thoroughly more sober and efficient affair with grey metal and glass everywhere, all very G-Plan. The new 7 was well received too, but at the time the praise seemed possibly a little more muted than the new Jag. There was only one car there - a really low spec 730i. My dad thought it a bit grim. I discovered later that the E32 could be a lovely car in the right spec, but I always preferred the Jag. The new Jaguar would tarnish itself somewhat in the following year with teething problems, which was rather sad given the car's big heart and many abilities. It's reputation would nevr recover, the car becoming yet another unappreciated but excellent British car. BMW however would never look back. The E32 was a market force in the way the E23 never achieved. I also noticed how much younger and 'go-ahead' as they said at the time the BMW customers were. All big smiles, super-confidence, shiny suits and filofaxes. The Jaguar customers all looked like John Harvey-Jones.
Jaguar XJ40 the legend 1/3
Jaguar XJ40 the legend 2/3
Jaguar XJ40 the legend 3/3
Even though they were a small company with limited resources, Jaguar put a huge effort into the design of the XJ40. Was the XJ40 the last major production car designed by a handful of people?
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Re: Jaguar Sovereign: rust and rehabilitation.
Jaguar were always good at that - they hired the cleverest guys. I just remember the XJ40 looking really old even when it was launched, a time when the Series III really was making a comeback.
For all that though it was unmistakably a Jag, unlike the stuff they make now.
For all that though it was unmistakably a Jag, unlike the stuff they make now.
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Re: Jaguar Sovereign: rust and rehabilitation.
It probably did look old or at least very conservative indeed at launch - certainly next to an E32, or going down a class to the new Rover XX. That shouldn't be surprising since though the XJ40 was designed with a tiny expenditure of money, there was an extraordinary – indeed profligate – expenditure of time. The car was conceived as the direct replacement for the Series II – the Series III facelift was simply a stopgap introduced because the XJ40 was not ready. Development of the XJ40 began, incredibly, in 1972. The car's styling was in all but minor detail fixed by the end of 1980 - a full six years before launch, an eternity in car terms. Minor detailing would always let the XJ40 down, even in its final form.The Reverend Bluejeans wrote: ↑Sat Jul 10, 2021 10:08 am Jaguar were always good at that - they hired the cleverest guys. I just remember the XJ40 looking really old even when it was launched, a time when the Series III really was making a comeback.
For all that though it was unmistakably a Jag, unlike the stuff they make now.
Such was the chaos at British Leyland, that John Egan reveals in his book ‘Saving Jaguar’ (ISBN 978-1-907085-31-4) that on privatisation, he discovered to his horror that BL didn’t own the name ‘Jaguar’ – but had allowed it to lapse many years before. The name was owned by a company in Pakistan making cheap tennis rackets and a sports bag emblazoned with their Jaguar logo and Jaguar needed to buy the rights to its own name from him. Egan also reveals that he had held real concerns about the rectangular headlight treatment of the new XJ40 and the loss of four round lights and raised the issue with Sir William Lyons. Lyons took a hands-on interest in the XJ40 and replied firmly that he was certain about them – and they should stay. I agree with him, but they are more '1980' than '1990'.
These photos show just how long and drawn out the XJ40’s development was. The photos are from a styling clinic put on to assess Jaguar buyer’s reactions to the XJ40 – in this case in March 1981 – more than five years before the car was launched, yet the XJ40 looks very similar to the 1986 car.
Parked outside Wappenbury Hall with Sir William Lyons IIRC some time in 1980:
And in the 1970s:
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Re: Jaguar Sovereign: rust and rehabilitation.
The Princess styling clay in November 1970, 4.5 years before launch. Harris Mann is on the far left.
The same year as the first Mark 3 Cortina.
The same year as the first Mark 3 Cortina.
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Re: Jaguar Sovereign: rust and rehabilitation.
BL really did know how to lose from a winning position.
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Re: Jaguar Sovereign: rust and rehabilitation.
I saw similar working for a large Telco.
A lot of management time was spent either building empires or defending them. Given the senior management and therefore strategy frequently changed it was pretty much the perfect storm.
A lot of management time was spent either building empires or defending them. Given the senior management and therefore strategy frequently changed it was pretty much the perfect storm.
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Re: Jaguar Sovereign: rust and rehabilitation.
The next time I went down to the body shop to see my car I was particularly anxious to discover what was going on inside the bulkhead, under the scuttle. The previous time I had seen my car I poked my finger down the hole here and felt the rust flakes give way down below with quite a crunch. My heart really sank: I know how bad these '40s can be.
The same place without the front wing - and before I pressed my finger on it, making a hole:
With the top scuttle panel removed, the inside of the bulkhead was revealed, which, I am relieved to say, is in excellent rust free condition. The brown staining is dust stuck on to a wax coating on the metal, and sitting on top of the seam sealer. It can be wiped off easily to reveal bright paintwork. Phew!
The top of the right hand end piece of the scuttle panel. This is made from very thin metal, unlike the bulkhead below which is of much heavier grade.
The underside of the same piece of metal. Water has got into this small rectangular compartment then been held there by what remains of the cavity’s foam filling. The foam was a rancid gelatinous slime. Water condensing on the underside of the top panel has rotted through the metal over time.
However, the top panel is the extent of the rust. Despite the brown look on the photograph, the ‘compartment’ floor and sides are not rusty. The discolouration is a mixture of rust flakes and dust sticking to a thin wax coating Jaguar must have sprayed over the paint. The crunching sensation must have been my finger compressing the flaked remains of the top panel which had dropped through into the cavity. Some of the rust was close in texture to soil.
Overview of the inside of the bulkhead cavity, now the scuttle top panel has been removed:
Closer in:
The whole interior of the plenum is in excellent condition – again the brown areas are a wax preservative.
Photographed from the rear – there is a small area of rust where the bulkhead front meets the inner wing, but nothing more:
The whole cavity viewed from the right hand side – no rust there:
The small area of surface rust is the extent of it:
The left hand side was in similar condition, but cleaner since the top panel was not so bad on this side.
Viewed from above:
And from the side across the plenum cavity from the left hand side:
Again the whole structure is rust free:
Clearly on my car water was not getting into the car from the bulkhead - which is unusual on the XJ40. A wet cabin is the typical sign of bulkhead rust - steamed up windows equals rust on the 'Forty! - It explains why the cabin of my car remained dry, even though the car looked so rusty.
The same place without the front wing - and before I pressed my finger on it, making a hole:
With the top scuttle panel removed, the inside of the bulkhead was revealed, which, I am relieved to say, is in excellent rust free condition. The brown staining is dust stuck on to a wax coating on the metal, and sitting on top of the seam sealer. It can be wiped off easily to reveal bright paintwork. Phew!
The top of the right hand end piece of the scuttle panel. This is made from very thin metal, unlike the bulkhead below which is of much heavier grade.
The underside of the same piece of metal. Water has got into this small rectangular compartment then been held there by what remains of the cavity’s foam filling. The foam was a rancid gelatinous slime. Water condensing on the underside of the top panel has rotted through the metal over time.
However, the top panel is the extent of the rust. Despite the brown look on the photograph, the ‘compartment’ floor and sides are not rusty. The discolouration is a mixture of rust flakes and dust sticking to a thin wax coating Jaguar must have sprayed over the paint. The crunching sensation must have been my finger compressing the flaked remains of the top panel which had dropped through into the cavity. Some of the rust was close in texture to soil.
Overview of the inside of the bulkhead cavity, now the scuttle top panel has been removed:
Closer in:
The whole interior of the plenum is in excellent condition – again the brown areas are a wax preservative.
Photographed from the rear – there is a small area of rust where the bulkhead front meets the inner wing, but nothing more:
The whole cavity viewed from the right hand side – no rust there:
The small area of surface rust is the extent of it:
The left hand side was in similar condition, but cleaner since the top panel was not so bad on this side.
Viewed from above:
And from the side across the plenum cavity from the left hand side:
Again the whole structure is rust free:
Clearly on my car water was not getting into the car from the bulkhead - which is unusual on the XJ40. A wet cabin is the typical sign of bulkhead rust - steamed up windows equals rust on the 'Forty! - It explains why the cabin of my car remained dry, even though the car looked so rusty.
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