Stellantis. Is it the 21st century global British Leyland?

[LynehamHerc]

Tata group as a whole is probably bigger and a larger cash pile than VAG?
Automobile companies profit levels for a long time have always been pretty dismal for the amount of capital expenditure needed.

How many cars does VAG sell a year? Millions and millions.

Jaguar needs VAG level investment, but for what? 50,000 cars a year?

If they can have a lot of under the skin commonality with Range Rover it could be quite profitable if they can achieve Bentleyesque prices as has been suggested. To me the big question is can they? If not you could still fix their costs so they seemed to be.

[SiC]

Tata group as a whole is probably bigger and a larger cash pile than VAG?
Automobile companies profit levels for a long time have always been pretty dismal for the amount of capital expenditure needed.

How many cars does VAG sell a year? Millions and millions.

Jaguar needs VAG level investment, but for what? 50,000 cars a year?

Premium cars are comparatively higher margins though. So don’t necessarily need more units sold. Obviously hundreds of thousands is beneficial but if priced correctly and to a high enough standard they can do alright. It’s why Range Rover does well as they’re very expensive but not necessarily a lot more expensive to produce than say a Skoda Octavia. It’s why small cheap cars are all but disappearing - they just aren’t profits enough.

The way Tesla is going, TATA could acquire them to use the drivetrain tech of them with the interior and exterior styling expertise of JLR. Whether either could nail down a robust product is another matter.

[SiC]

Jaguar will probably just end up as RR with a different badge nailed on them to save development costs. Given the love for SUVs they probably would still sell.

[NorfolkNWeigh]

Re: JLR , in summer 2019 on a holiday to Granada, we went to the very top of the Sierra Nevada just for a look, the road up there was full of prototypes testing, mostly Mercs but BMWs, VAG shite, weird Chinky SUVs and quite a few Transits ( mostly parked up and electric , apparently) It’s perfect for testing as it’s fucking high up and 40 odd degrees.
Anyway at the top which is lots of little bars and cafes for skiers , there was a Discovery Sport and a LWB ( Chinese market ) XE being parked up in the sun. I got chatting to the two blokes locking them up. They said Mercedes had 300 people including local drivers, 2 big mobile workshops , a catering truck and a helicopter.
“ How many people have you guys got here?” I asked.
“ Me and Steve and a local agency guy in a rented Focus on his way to pick us up!”
That brought home how inconsequential JLR are in the grand scheme of things.

Maybe that’s why I’ve since bought an XF , I’m just an old romantic.

[NorfolkNWeigh]

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[AutoshiteBoy]

Tata should bring the CityRover back.

[SiC]

They said Mercedes had 300 people including local drivers, 2 big mobile workshops , a catering truck and a helicopter.

I probably shouldn't say this but meh. But did you know that every button and switch they have is setup to have the exactly same click sound/feel.
They also have a place in Northern Germany by the sea where panels are left exposed to see the effect of paint and metal degradation over long periods.

[Eddie Honda]

They also have a place in Northern Germany by the sea where panels are left exposed to see the effect of paint and metal degradation over long periods.

Could of just paid Drum a couple of quid...and save a load of time.

[Warren t claim]

Re: JLR , in summer 2019 on a holiday to Granada, we went to the very top of the Sierra Nevada just for a look, the road up there was full of prototypes testing, mostly Mercs but BMWs, VAG shite, weird Chinky SUVs and quite a few Transits ( mostly parked up and electric , apparently) It’s perfect for testing as it’s fucking high up and 40 odd degrees.
Anyway at the top which is lots of little bars and cafes for skiers , there was a Discovery Sport and a LWB ( Chinese market ) XE being parked up in the sun. I got chatting to the two blokes locking them up. They said Mercedes had 300 people including local drivers, 2 big mobile workshops , a catering truck and a helicopter.
“ How many people have you guys got here?” I asked.
“ Me and Steve and a local agency guy in a rented Focus on his way to pick us up!”
That brought home how inconsequential JLR are in the grand scheme of things.

Maybe that’s why I’ve since bought an XF , I’m just an old romantic.

Norman didn't require an entourage.

[LynehamHerc]

Regarding Germans developing things:

Some 20 years ago I was working near Heidelberg for about 6 months helping the biggest German software house develop a new industry solution. The project manager was German and went ballistic when she saw me copying and pasting code. That's not the way we do things!
So basically I was expected to re key it with all the possible additional errors.

Needless to say her and I didn't get on to the extent that she complained to my boss to try and get me sacked. That didn't work but when I had to go back there a couple of months later, for the final presentation to management, you could have cut the air with a knife, especially when my name came up on screen as being one of the developers.